This move further highlights the new formations of strategic alliances in the Middle East. It is sure to infuriate and humiliate Turkey, which has been bursting with pride over its new “conquest” of Hagia Sophia, which was first built in 537 as a Christian cathedral. The reconversion of this Christian jewel into a mosque grieved and angered Christians worldwide. Muslims screamed “Allahu akbar” as it officially became a Mosque. The Middle East Monitor reported that “Turkey may have reclaimed the leadership of Sunni Islam from Saudi Arabia” as “Erdogan reasserts Turkey’s status as a regional power.”
68% of Greeks are dissatisfied with the global response to Turkey, and want to see the EU levy sanctions against Turkey. This move by Syria, with help from Russia, as announced by The Moscow Times, is a slap in the face to Turkey.
“Syrian government to build replica of Hagia Sophia,” by Sean Joyner, Archinect News, Jul 30, 2020:
According to Duvar English, the Syrian government has announced that it will build a replica of Instanbul’s [sic] Hagia Sophia after the Turkish government recently converted it into a mosque. Moscow will provide funding for the project “to show the importance of ‘peaceful dialogue’ between faiths.” Built in 537, the Hagia Sophia is a classic example of Byzantine architecture and was then the largest interior space in the world. The structure is a UNESCO World Heritage Site….
mortimer says
All countries should boycott Turkish tourism.
How would Muslims feel if the Kaaba were turned into a Marxist conference center or Hindu shrine? They would not like someone doing the same thing to them.
Erdolf has poisoned Islamic relations with non-Muslims. The world now sees that Muslims are intolerant, aggressive, sly, and lacking empathy.
Chrissie01 says
Islamic relations with non-Muslims have always been poisoned. From the start. But you are right: This is a new climax
Hindu American says
No offence but Kaaba was a Hindu pilgrimage center before its takeover by the new cult.
http://www.danielpipes.org/comments/178056
gravenimage says
It is possible–although not terribly likely–that there was a Hindu presence at the Ka’aba pre-Islam. But Hindu traders do appear to have been in Oman pre-Islam, so this is not impossible.
Certainly, though, the Ka’aba represented dozens or even hundreds of faiths pre-Islam.
Reziac says
Considering Islam has few original ideas, but plagiarized from whatever was handy, it wouldn’t surprise me if some elements were snagged from Hindu practice.
And I just had a vision of early Muslim leaders laughing their asses off as they watched gullible tribesmen circling the stone, as said leaders had instructed them to do.
barbaracvm1 says
Istanbul is the Muslim’s name for Constantinople. We should use the pre Muslim name, Constantinople . The muslims would all to often change the name of town, rivers etc. The Pillars of Hercules is now knowen as Gibraltar.
Demsci says
But then I don’t know what to make of the other Turkish cities names, Barbara. Yes, they have changed but at the same time one can clearly discern the original names. Examples; Trabzon was Trebizond, Iznik was Nicea, Izmir was Smyrna, Konya was Iconium, Kayseri was Caesarea, Antalya was Attalia.
Any way, when I tell Turkish people the original names, they seem unable to grasp this. They seem not to have learned this at school. They seem not to know much about Turkey before 1071. They always change or drift into another subject, having no interest whatsoever in history lessons. But those are just my experiences (Among many Turkish citizens of Holland)..
Recently there seems to be a spike in DNA tests among young Turkish people. And when they do that test they are likely to find out that much of current DNA is of the original inhabitants before 1071 (92 versus 8 % Real Turkish) and much related to the Greeks (as the food also is, I hear). When I see such origines I so wonder; How the hell did the people there end up SPEAKING TURKISH? I mean after the Norman conquest (1066) English did NOT “change” into French, if you will.
Ecosse1314 says
True..but French did remain the language of the ruling classes for centuries.
gravenimage says
Right, Demsci.
gravenimage says
In slap at Turkey, Syrian government to build replica of Hagia Sophia with help from Russia
…………………
Well, *this* is interesting. Hope it happens.
Keith O says
G I, unfortunately I don’t think so. Assad has turned Syria into a basket case and they would have trouble building a dirt road, let alone a copy of the Hagia Sophia.
Tom S. says
I agree. Neither Russia nor Syria, or the two combined, have the wherewithal to duplicate the Hagia Sophia anymore than Iran can build even a laughable mockup of the USS Nimitz.
gravenimage says
Keith, this is sadly true. I doubt that Syria has the wherewithal to attempt anything like this. I’m sure he has irked the Turks by even suggesting this, though.
barbaracvm1 says
Not just Syria but I hope many other countries build a replica of the Hagia Sophia; and that it is used an Orthodox church.
Wellington says
Both Putin and the Russian Orthodox Patriarch, Kirill, have acted in full subservient dhimmi mode. This serves as just one more example. Shame on them both.
So much for Moscow being the Third Rome. What a joke.
gravenimage says
This is grimly true. I doubt that Putin will actually cut his dealings with Turkey in any substantive way. Worst of all, Russia is still selling Turkey arms.
Dieks62 says
Turkey is also a big sporting arms mfg’er himself, producing mostly cheap low-quality copies of Beretta/Benelli shotguns, airguns & handguns! Sadly, a substantial nr of Quisling ?? & ?? hunters don’t seem to be bothered by any bad conscience, are perfectly fine with buying this junk and in doing so, they’re actively supporting the Ottoman deadcults empire with their European conquest!
Frank Anderson says
It may be a good time to reflect on the Patriarch Isaac. One of the several stories about his life concerned his digging a well. Back then and in that location, a well was a major project with great value. Neighboring thugs came and ran him and his away from the well. Instead of going to war, Isaac dug another well. It was stolen by violent conquest. Isaac, being a determined man, dug a third. The thugs got the message. Isaac named the third well Rehoboth, “room for both”. (from my days in Baptist Sunday School).
I have in another thread raised the idea of destroying the value of the present Hagia Sophia, which has been built according to Wikipedia 3 times, by duplicating it in every detail wherever Orthodox Christians gather and worship. It would be both an act of defiance and a display of commitment. It is strange that muslims seem to agree with the proposal.
gravenimage says
In Syria, this would be Assad. He is an Alawite–an offshoot of Shia Islam–and he enjoys twitting Sunnis. I think this is mostly what this proposal is about, Frank
Frank Anderson says
GI, I am hardly proposing that any Christian community spend a dime or a minute building a church in a muslim country. I am proposing that Orthodox Christians learn from the Diaspora where Jews lost the Temple in 70 AD/CE and had to adapt. Christians and all other communities who wish to live and worship in peace should pay attention to the experience that holds them together.
If HS is rendered without value by duplication, more people can enjoy the inspiration without feeding the muslim landlords. Believe it or not, I actually have Orthodox friends including 27 college juniors from the former Soviet Union I served as guardian angel during their year in the US.
gravenimage says
Frank, I believe that Hagia Sophia would still be of great value due to her history–but certainly recreating this treasure elsewhere would be an interesting thing.
Frank Anderson says
GI, think of all the logical responses possible. Which is most likely to serve those presently being disrespected and oppressed and at the same time defeating the tyrants. Tyrants want war. They want to discourage their enemies. They want to see their enemies cower in fear instead of rising in defiance and effective resistance.
There is a reason for the time being to accept the stealing of HS1 and destroying its value as being unique.
It took Isaac 3 wells to convince his neighbors that he could not be bullied. It may take more than 3 HS’s to build the resistance needed to stop and reverse 1400 years of murder and conquest. The 1 standing in Constantinople/Byzantium/Istanbul is the third one built; so building another is shown to be possible. “The longest journey begins with the first step.” This could be a first step of effective resistance.
Any other ideas in the alternative?
gravenimage says
Frank, it is Erdogan who is trying to destroy the value of Hagia Sophia as a Church. I’m not sure that we would want to destroy this great Cathedral.
And no one else has built a Hagia Sophia with this great dome and mosaics–and even if they did today, it would not destroy the achievement of the Byzantines who erected this great treasure. That is not how copies of art work. In fact, many great works of art have been copied, albeit rarely on this scale.
The Palace of the Legion of Honor in San Francisco is a three-quarter scale copy of the 18th-century Legion of Honor in Paris, built in the early 20th century. This was built as a tribute to the great French building, *not* as an attempt to destroy the worth of the original. In fact, the French after WWI gave their blessing to it. It is part of the Fine Arts Museums here.
And it is great that you served as host to these visitors from the Soviet Union. That must have been fascinating.
Frank Anderson says
GI, my father by choice #7 called me and said “Frank, I’ve got 27 Russians at the University of South Alabama. Take care of them. Bye!” It was a good year. I helped one earn a PhD in Accounting, graduating #1 in her class. I wanted such a degree but could not get into a program. So when the chance to help her appeared, I took it.
If the destruction of HS were a goal, muslims know how to do it. I propose to make the memory more valuable by removing without risk the danger to Christians and other infidels of enjoying the real value. This is the same fixation that I see in the Temple before its destruction and the adaptive measures and skills demonstrated by Judaism after it was destroyed. HS can be replicated without damage to the original, just as one candle can light another without losing its flame. Then visitors can worship without fear, and the tribute revenue they bring to muslim conquerors would stop. The God of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and Jesus is everywhere. Places are not worshipped
Isaac and Rehoboth. What if Isaac had submitted at the first well?
gravenimage says
Thanks for the reply, Frank. Certainly, building Christian Churches in the face of Islamic aggression is not a bad thing.
Frank Anderson says
Consider the inspiration to the entire community as new churches are being built. It worked before and it can work again. If the people cannot go to HS safely, then bring HS to them in safety.
DH says
But Erdogan still has his 1,150 room, $615 million mansion. Na na na na na NAH. It’s 4 times as big as Versailles. Beat that Bashaar.
Keys says
From Time magazine, Nov. 2014:
“President Recep Tayyip Erdogan’s presidential palace, over 30 times the size of the White House and four times the size of Versailles, is costing Turkey $615 million, the country’s finance minister said Tuesday.
The lavish residence, which had an expected price tag of $315 million, comes with a $185 million Airbus presidential jet tailored to Erdogan’s design preferences, according to Bloomberg.
For years, the former Turkish Prime Minister had been accused of abusing taxpayers’ money when he helped design the extravagant, 1,000-room building known as the White Palace. Several court orders were ineffective in stopping the construction and expansion of the building, which totals over 3.1 million square feet.”
Erdogan’s critics believe the mega mansion is a sign that he feels superior to the law that governs the country, an economist at GlobalSource Partners told Bloomberg. Other critics have likened Erdogan’s palace to the People’s Palace built by Romania’s communist dictator Nicolae Ceausescu, who was infamous for his brutal and repressive regime.”
Charles says
Build it in memory of Khalid Al Asaad the Syrian archeologist who was martyred in Palmyra. Then build a replica of the Bath’s of Trajan in memory of one of history’s forgotten Architects, Apollodorus of Damascus. Bashar Assad always impressed me as an intelligent and fair minded man.
Bad Penguin says
What a same on the world for letting Turkey do this.
I have been to the Hagia Sophia several times years ago and it was a beautiful place. It won’t be long before the christian mosaics will be defaced and covered up.
AleX says
I doubt that would happen in a moslem country. If it happens, then Russia needs be congratulated. I will thus hold my ‘Поздравляю Россию’ for when it’s done.
James Lincoln says
согласна !
AleX says
С надеждой!
jimmy says
Better make this new one earthquake proof. Then it will, eventually, be the only one.
gravenimage says
I don’t think the main threats of Hagia Sophia are earthquakes…
jimmy says
https://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/earthquakes-pose-threat-to-historic-monuments-in-istanbul-73854
gravenimage says
I am well aware of this, jimmy–I live in San Francisco, which is always at risk from earthquakes.
I just meant that Islam is a more direct, immediate threat to Hagia Sophia than are earthquakes or other natural disasters.
Relic says
black belt
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GVqk1-Ed6jQ
libertyORdeath says
What a great way to spend time, money and manpower during a civil war!
gravenimage says
I doubt this is actually going to happen–it is just Assad twitting the Sunnis.
Phil says
Great idea! Plant a new Hagia Sophia in the heart of Syria in the middle East and start converting the populace back to Christianity with all its freedoms and potential. Islam shall perish.
gravenimage says
Assad sure isn’t going to do *that*.
Ben Kennedy says
So the Syrians who were involved in the terrorist attack (attempted) in Moscow were really there to scare the Russians into wanting to cuddle up to Syria in hopes of diverting their wrath from the Russian people? It’s plausible, is it not? After all, they only killed one terrorist, and arrested his brother while all the others escaped. And the Russians say to Syria; please don’t hurt us and we will “cry tears and blah blah blah for you? As a cold war enemy, you could trust the Russians to act in some predictable way. These days, they act in unpredictable ways as a weak kneed victim. Russia, a Syrian puppet?
gravenimage says
Muslims hate Infidels and want to kill them. This is one of the few things you can count on.
Brian Hoff says
This will be than Sophia mosqu.
gravenimage says
Is “Brian Hoff”–really, “DefenderofIslam”–threatening us with violently turning this replica of Hagia Sophia into a Mosque, as well? Why not? He *is* a thug, who has said that he and his fellow Muslims will destroy the US Constitution and use American women as sex slaves.